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  #51  
Old November 30th, 2007, 10:31 PM
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The line I like is Bootstap's, "One day ashore, 10 years at sea" The way that line is it can interpreted to suit either form. Will says "depends on the one day", I always though of it as depends on whether or not your love is there come time.

And I think, because regardless of already having a love he became the captain and in exchange for being able to live, it's 10 yrs. duty.

I always had to think to, Will and Elizabeth were placed as the couple that is the complete opposite of Davy and Calypso, W/E's love was true, while Davy and Calypso's wasn't so why would they suffer the same fate?
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  #52  
Old November 30th, 2007, 10:43 PM
absoluteimp
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Originally Posted by mirkwoodelfchick View Post
I think it's fun to have these discussions of all of our differing takes on things... you can even speculate in here without getting modded

I find it interesting how some people will do anything to twist things around so there is a happy ending, and then you have others who twist things their was. It's all in accordance with how you, as an individual, saw the ending.

*sits back and waits for more*
Am I twisting?
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  #53  
Old December 1st, 2007, 12:05 AM
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Well, again this is probably just more of my self-delusion , and certainly just my opinion, but I think that the final editing of the movie and the reason for this pamphlet that seems to be included with the AWE DVD with "answers to movie-goers questions," was not a result of any fundamental plot change from what the writers originally intended to convey, but a decision made by whomever (Gore, Jerry, Disney?) to leave themselves plenty of maneuverability to write a possible POTC 4 however they chose (including the limitations imposed by which actors returned) and to keep the fans anticipating any future sequels. After all if everything was spelled out clearly and wrapped up in a nice tidy ending, there wouldn't be much need for discussion, just like we are having.

The precedent that I see for these actions was much like what happened after DMC and all the controversy over the supposed "love triangle." Immediately after DMC was released, there were posts on Wordplay by Terry & Ted that there was no triangle and that any "choice" to be made on Elizabeth's part was clearly made by the end of the second movie. However, they soon backed away from this definitive answer and became increasingly more vague about Elizabeth's feelings. (I won't even get into the whole compass and "what you want most" versus "heart's desire" mess.) Even Jerry B., in interviews after DMC, floated the idea that AWE would be about whom Elizabeth chose. Yet, in my view, at least, AWE seemed to ignore the thought of a triangle, unless you count Will's choice between saving his father or being with Elizabeth. This plot confusion, seemingly manipulated and encouraged by TPTB, just stirred debate among fans and increased anticipation for the third movie.

If leaving the audience in turmoil worked once to maintain interest, why not just keep doing it? In my "twisted" logic , however, I'm not falling for that again.

Last edited by anniej; December 1st, 2007 at 01:12 AM.
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  #54  
Old December 1st, 2007, 12:16 AM
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Am I twisting?
Twisted, maybe I kid, I kid!

Mirk
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  #55  
Old December 1st, 2007, 01:29 AM
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HAHAHA was going to make the same joke but backed out at last moment..hheeheheh am lily livered bilge rat evidently.
just joking, you know...

well you maybe right- a ploy to keep all options open, i fear however that is like DR Who or the X Files..can never truly make logical sense, and maybe that is just fine
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  #56  
Old December 1st, 2007, 02:05 AM
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I think that one scene is important. Look again at the tea-party with Beckett, Will and DJ.
When asked by Will, DJ said,that Calypso (spelling ?) can't be trusted, because she gave DJ "no choice".

Which choice (after the first 10-year-period) would that have been?

I think, that this is the choice that the former captain of the Flying Dutchman (the wagnerian from the 17th century) had. If he finds a true love, he will be free (he was freed, because Senta's love was true, the whole thing was rather tragic...).

The conversation between Calypso and DJ in the brig of the Black Pearl was mostly (in regard of the curse) plurivalent.

The green flash is throughout the whole movie - there are no other concepts in this movie - defined as a sign for somebody "coming back from death". So, I don't see how it could be just a sign for the transfer of the Flying Dutchman to another realm. This meaning is not supported throughout the whole movie.

For me, there are questions that are not answered in this movie. And I think (hope), that I found some answers (for me), that are logical whithin this universe (and I don't even like Wagner that much...).

I wish all who who celibrate the christian holidays a happy first Advent.

Turi
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  #57  
Old December 2nd, 2007, 12:51 PM
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  #58  
Old December 3rd, 2007, 01:40 PM
Pirate-x-Girls Pirate-x-Girls is offline
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I'm with you Stormdancer! Happy endings are good, but the discussions that are coming from this thread are intriguing. If I had a beard I would be stroking it now whilst contemplating all the possible avenues of this conversation. As Nuit said about it being a film, i believe that films are there to be debated about because if all the endings were predicatble and happy where would the enjoyment of debating the right ending come from!
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  #59  
Old December 3rd, 2007, 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by Pirate-x-Girls View Post
I'm with you Stormdancer! Happy endings are good, but the discussions that are coming from this thread are intriguing. If I had a beard I would be stroking it now whilst contemplating all the possible avenues of this conversation. As Nuit said about it being a film, i believe that films are there to be debated about because if all the endings were predicatble and happy where would the enjoyment of debating the right ending come from!
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  #60  
Old December 4th, 2007, 07:38 AM
siriwaree siriwaree is offline
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I don't know if anyone have seen this yet. "Top questions moviegoers had about"

http://www.chud.com/index.php?type=dvd&id=12762
scroll down the page,..

Is this really come with the dvd? i haven't got mine yet.
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  #61  
Old December 4th, 2007, 07:46 PM
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I agree with you Mirk. I just got done watching it on DVD ( bought it at 9am this morning!! ) It does say that one day every 10 years but saying nothing about the curse being lifted at anytime. It leaves it SSOOOOO open to how the viewer sees it in their eyes.

* sitting back with Mirk, I brought the chocolate *
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  #62  
Old December 4th, 2007, 09:14 PM
Leggybelle Leggybelle is offline
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When AWE first came out and I saw the ending with Will dying and then brought back to Captain the Flying Dutchman, I loved the ending !!! It was a classic mythology ending with true love facing impossible odds, and no happily-ever-after. It was, in my mind, Will's foreseen "destiny", and he understood it at the end and accepted his fate.

Then, posters on boards began to see things differenty, and decided that the ending, and various hints in the movie, were ambiguous -- and you could pick any ending you wanted !!!

I could see both sides, and being a romantic at heart, I changed my mind and gave Will and Elizabeth their happy ending, with Will being restored to "life" and able to leave the FD after 10 years.

Now comes the DVD release, with it's supplement -- seemingly taking away the "happily-ever-after" ending, and dooming Will to sail with the FD forever, seeing Elizabeth only l day every 10 years !!!

But the last sentence intrigued me....."their's is a story yet to be told" (or something like that).....leaving the possibility of another movie ??? Maybe in 10 years we will have them reunited and the whole "curse" thing resolved !!!
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  #63  
Old December 4th, 2007, 09:36 PM
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Agreed Leggybelle.AWE has a beautiful myth-like quality about it.
Particularly Will and Elizabeth take on an awesomeness that was unexpected.I love it.
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  #64  
Old December 4th, 2007, 09:47 PM
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I think it is Pintel, when talking about the green flash, who says it means a soul is returned from the dead. Have to go check my DVD and see if I am remembering it right. Anyway, I prefer to have Liz and Will in each other's arms, though sadly mortal.
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  #65  
Old December 4th, 2007, 10:39 PM
Malene
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For me,the magic of Will and Elizabeth is that the way their story is told,I still want more for them.If we had gotten a nicely wrapped up happily ever after story,I wouldn't have loved them as much as I do now.
The bittersweetness works well for me.
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  #66  
Old December 5th, 2007, 12:12 AM
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Question

Wait! What if... when Elizabeth dies... her son has her body go over the falls of World's End right at her dying moment? That way, her soul would separate from her body and go to the other world, and her body would be right there again. It could go back into it, I guess, and maybe Will and Liz could sail together forever, finally physically together? And Will's one day on land could be used by going to visit his son every decade. With the green flash return, perhaps Elizabeth could come back, too, and then go back with Will.

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Originally Posted by mamakidd View Post
I think it is Pintel, when talking about the green flash, who says it means a soul is returned from the dead. Have to go check my DVD and see if I am remembering it right. Anyway, I prefer to have Liz and Will in each other's arms, though sadly mortal.
Aye! Will and Liz should be in the living world together!

However... if Liz went to the Fountain... the two of 'em wouldn't be mortal, would they?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Leggybelle View Post
When AWE first came out and I saw the ending with Will dying and then brought back to Captain the Flying Dutchman, I loved the ending !!! It was a classic mythology ending with true love facing impossible odds, and no happily-ever-after. It was, in my mind, Will's foreseen "destiny", and he understood it at the end and accepted his fate.

Then, posters on boards began to see things differenty, and decided that the ending, and various hints in the movie, were ambiguous -- and you could pick any ending you wanted !!!

I could see both sides, and being a romantic at heart, I changed my mind and gave Will and Elizabeth their happy ending, with Will being restored to "life" and able to leave the FD after 10 years.

Now comes the DVD release, with it's supplement -- seemingly taking away the "happily-ever-after" ending, and dooming Will to sail with the FD forever, seeing Elizabeth only l day every 10 years !!!

But the last sentence intrigued me....."their's is a story yet to be told" (or something like that).....leaving the possibility of another movie ??? Maybe in 10 years we will have them reunited and the whole "curse" thing resolved !!!
I'd love another movie with Will and Liz in it... but Keira has said that she's not interested in doing any more POTC movies...
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  #67  
Old December 5th, 2007, 01:48 PM
Pirate-x-Girls Pirate-x-Girls is offline
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I did contemplate the idea of Elizabeth dying at sea yada yada yada and staying with Will. And I forgot that some people only got AWE yesterday, for once, the UK is ahead of the USA! This is all so intruging and for me it's mastefull writing if you can make such an uproar and make so many different ways to interpret the story!

Edit: And I just looked over this and thought 'Oh dear God what have i started!'
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  #68  
Old January 7th, 2008, 05:46 AM
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Hi :), I know this thread has been alone for almost a month, but I was searching information about the curse and I found this in the Wikipedia

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Will_Turner

Quote:
Furthermore, in the end of the videogame of "Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End" Will tells Elizabeth he has taken the place of Davy Jones and must pay his debt with 10 years at sea. He says that after he has paid the debt he will return to her. This implies that after the first 10 years, when Will has paid his debt and is no longer bound to the Dutchman he is free of the curse and can stay with Elizabeth and their son.
I have no clue if this is true or not 'cause I don't really play games, but if someone does and this end is real.... could someone upload it to youtube or something?? I'll love to see it :), I like this version a lot

Hugs!! Be well and take care, Monica
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  #69  
Old January 7th, 2008, 06:14 AM
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So, Will is a 'psychopomp' - oooh, everything has a label, so it seems.

Thanks for this - makes me feel much better about that stupid ending. I had read something similar elsewhere but this just cements it for me. I'm with the writer's intentions on this one, definitely!

Thanks Monica (great AVi & Sig by the way - yummy Balian is always a treat to look at.)

cheers
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  #70  
Old January 7th, 2008, 01:57 PM
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There's a thing on wikipedia regrading the questions from that dvd booklet stating that neither the directors or the writers really answered the questions asked from the booklet including the one about Will being forever bound to the Dutchman. So my guess is that the answers were just made up for fun by the people who manufacture the Pirates dvd, and are not really meant to be taken seriously.

I don't think the people from Disney would want to give up their secrets anyway.
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  #71  
Old January 7th, 2008, 09:16 PM
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I'm with you in this idea Artzygirl, I mean if as some had said, with more knowledge than me, than the idea even in the original opera is that if there is true love then the curse is lifted the ones tha made the booklet where just playing around, I believe he's free and happy

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Thanks Monica (great AVi & Sig by the way - yummy Balian is always a treat to look at.)

cheers
Luna
Thanks Luna :), yeah, he's gorgeous and the amazing Araestel is so great with this things... she also made my banner in LJ and wow, she's great with Balian :), hugs!!! Be well and take care, Monica
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  #72  
Old January 8th, 2008, 09:19 AM
Pirate-x-Girls Pirate-x-Girls is offline
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I have played the video game fo At Worlds End, i had it on PS2 and now have it on PS3, and what Erin says is true, Will does say to Elizabeth that he will come back to her after 10 years. But how reliable this is in relation to the films remains to be seen! Thanks for the info anyway!
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  #73  
Old January 8th, 2008, 10:21 AM
Miss Audra
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If only this writers strike wasn't going on Ted and Terry could have done their wonderful commentary and cleared all of this muck up for us.

Then we'd know the real answers

I say that the curse was 10 years at sea and if the one you loved was waiting for you your turn aboard the Dutchman was over...but thats just my hopeless romantic peeking out.

And I soooo knew back in Jan. of 07 that Will wasn't going to make it through to to the end, those Pap pics of Keira filming her scene on the beach alone clued me off that Will wasn't going to get off scotch-free.
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  #74  
Old January 8th, 2008, 04:06 PM
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Thank you, Erin_21, for giving this hint.

This end would be so much better for me. I hated the end of the film when I watched it the first time in theatre.

But on the other hand it sounds a bit odd to me that a computer game shall answer the most important question about a very popoluar movie. That's kind of unromantic IMO. [You can see: I'm no fan of computer-/video-games ]
But I'm open for everything new to make Will's fate a little clearer!
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  #75  
Old January 8th, 2008, 07:01 PM
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If only this writers strike wasn't going on Ted and Terry could have done their wonderful commentary and cleared all of this muck up for us.

Then we'd know the real answers

I say that the curse was 10 years at sea and if the one you loved was waiting for you your turn aboard the Dutchman was over...but thats just my hopeless romantic peeking out.

And I soooo knew back in Jan. of 07 that Will wasn't going to make it through to to the end, those Pap pics of Keira filming her scene on the beach alone clued me off that Will wasn't going to get off scotch-free.

I confess it's a brag, but I like to point out that I guessed as much in July 2006 and even posted about it in my LJ to prove it *G*. As I watched DMC, I kept thinking *Why are they trying to push him on us as being good at command? Why do they keep drawing all these parallels with Davy Jones and relationships with women and sacrifice, and showing how Will never drowns? And what the eff is up with 'touch of destiny?'*
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